Trackhawk is dead no more better grab one while you can

[Thawkmike]

I’m a city/suburban driving guy, 90% of the time, and I gotta vouch for the sub 11mpg.
I’ll guess if I take a pic of the screen, it’s going to read 10.8-10.9. I’ll take a pic when I get back in ...

That said, it’s a heavy foot city driving style. And I’ve also averaged 18-19 fully loaded for 500-600 miles trips.

So, take that for what it is.


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[Blown7]

Only up to 80 ish MPH here as I had to hold phone in one hand

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[ChargerChallenger]

Only up to 80 ish MPH here as I had to hold phone in one hand

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Wild man for sure and damn impressive I give you credit LOL. I have a hard time believing you're on factory tires. What shoes are you running and do you ever run into the front wheel well getting filled up with snow and ice and can't turn the wheel all the way.

 

[Jimmy N.]

Only up to 80 ish MPH here as I had to hold phone in one hand

I knew I couldn't be the only one who likes driving like that. Well, minus the phone.

 

[Chevyave]

Well I get it.. this is a basic car forum and not a total Jeep/Trackhawk forum.

However I call Bullshit.... on most of the stuff spouted here like 11 MPG..or torque steer..

My personal experience on driving my Trackhawk which now has 26K miles on the ODO from Connecticut to Juneau Alaska and back is..

I never got below 13 MPG driving 125 MPH on I-80/84 for extended stretches (30-50 mile runs) and a couple all out WOT runs at 175 MPH in Wyoming, Nebraska, Oregon,Idaho and the Canadian wilderness...all while carrying 900 pounds of mechanics tools and tool boxes in the back...

The average on a given day running the 80 MPH speed limit was 14-15 MPG..

It performed flawlessly at 140 MPH plus on 4 inches of glare ice/packed snow/ fresh 7 inch deep snow with the OEM Pirellis on the Canadian/ Alaskan highways.. thru British Columbia. and the Yukon .It was nice to climb thru the Cascades at 100+ MPH in the mountains ...while pulling 6-8 pounds of boost...and passing everything in sight...

Most times my fuel range was just under 400 miles per tank.. which is just about the range for my bladder

Yea if all you want is attention.. and to stand out ..the Trackhawk ain't it...

But if you need to carry your life support system and pull a 7K pound trailer halfway across the world in winter conditions with your vehicle being the thing between dying and surviving at 25-35 degrees below zero in the Canadian wilderness.. you ain't doing it in your Hellcat or Demon.

This trip has only reinforced my love and respect for the vehicle.

Ill post some vids and pics when I get a chance...

The gas mileage on the freeway is about 14 mpg if you consider that acceptable. However, commute in Dallas, Texas in stop and go traffic and you can expect 10-11 mpg. I would imagine most people are going to use this as a daily driver and will experience something similar if they live in a metro area. Also, any high horsepower AWD vehicle is going to have a different steering feel under heavy power compared to a RWD car. I have owned several and whether you want to call it torque steer, heaviness, lightness it is still there.

 

[Confuzed1]

The gas mileage on the freeway is about 14 mpg if you consider that acceptable. However, commute in Dallas, Texas in stop and go traffic and you can expect 10-11 mpg. I would imagine most people are going to use this as a daily driver and will experience something similar if they live in a metro area. Also, any high horsepower AWD vehicle is going to have a different steering feel under heavy power compared to a RWD car. I have owned several and whether you want to call it torque steer, heaviness, lightness it is still there.

Oh, but I can see the appeal of being thrown back in your seat hard enough to crack your back!! It would take a while for me for that to get old!!! Sure, you have to pay more for gas....or a chiropractor.....

 

[Jimmy N.]

The gas mileage on the freeway is about 14 mpg if you consider that acceptable.

I would think that the actual speed, and amount of passing (floored on 2-laners), is more influential than if it's a freeway or any other kind of road.

Although, since I have yet to be able to maintain over 85 mph due to the break-in period, I can't speak for real life mileage at this point. But it doesn't match the Challenger's, that much I can tell.
But even if it turns out to be only 5 mpg on average, the only thing I'll dislike is having to stop for fuel so often. I will only live once...or so I'm told.

 

[Jimmy N.]

It just dawned on me that at least you get slotted rotors with a Trackhawk...unlike those measly Redeyes.

 

[clayton006]

So I was part of a previous forum for Hellcats, I figure I would weigh in here.
I leased a 2016 Charger Hellcat. I got a decent deal but nothing great (I think total price was around 60k). I loved the car, but I also needed something FWD / AWD for the occasional bad weather in Ohio.

Eventually I had 3 cars myself (Hellcat, Fiesta ST, Focus RS) and the wife insisted I had to go down to one vehicle. My choices were going to be a Tesla Model X, and E63s Wagon, or a Trackhawk. While doing some looking I found a used Trackhawk that was fully loaded (all I wanted was the tow package and leather dash), and the color I wanted. It had 4000 miles and I grabbed it for 72k or 75k (can't recall). I grabbed it a year ago this month.

Driving the Trackhawk is for sure a different experience than the Charger. I do appreciate the AWD traction and no more wheel hop. I don't have any torque steer (except with my non performance winter tires on, that's more of them having crappy grip in the dry). Honestly I love this thing, and I believe I paid the right price for what I wanted.

My only complaint is the gas mileage. I typically get 11.2 - 11.7 for all city driving, and 13.5 for my combined trip. Granted, I only drive about 500-600 miles a month for the last 6 months so I'm not in it a ton anymore so gas isn't a major concern.

I'm probably looking to add another car in the next 2 years when I have the Trackhawk paid off. I may do a manual hellcat challenger as I miss rowing those gears. I can talk the wife into letting me have two again (I think).

Sorry for the long post, but two other interesting things:
1) I get a LOT more attention in the Jeep than I ever did in the Charger. I don't quite understand it, but young males seem to stop and want to chat about this thing and they are able to pick it out as they yell "Hey is that a Trackhawk?".
2) I was able to get 20.1 MPG in the Trackhawk. I drove nonstop from my door to Nashville, TN going 70mph in eco mode. I was quite surprised.

 

[Jimmy N.]

Clayton, I think you'll really like a Challenger.

Had I not driven and enjoyed a Challenger before getting the 'Hawk, I would've probably thought "Man, this thing is quick!".
Well, it is, but those extra pounds sure make themselves known when accelerating.

Full disclosure: I have only made a few 60-120s so far since I just got mine broken in (500 miles), but they sure seemed to take much longer than in the 'Cat.
Either that, or the short straight sections of road I used were just too short.

There's no way I'll ever match your 20.1 mph the way I drive, but...you have an excellent argument to use with your wife since even I get over 20 with my 'Cat. And my girlfriend over 22 with her Redeye.
Yes, the fuel savings will pay for the Challenger!

 

[clayton006]

One thing I forgot to mention as well is that I’ve been running into quite a few Trackhawks around my city. I’ve probably counted 8 or 10 unique ones. Some have driven up on our outerbelt and given me the thumbs up.

 

[Jack_Toepfer]

I just assumed a pulley swap would allow it to keep up with a Cat, is that reasonable?
I really wanted to convert to e85 and go for it all, but 3mpg doesn’t sound like too much fun.

 

[Thawkmike]

2.85 upper on race gas tune is good 10.5@130 in a TH at the strip.

On the street, in a similar distance, you’ll need a 150mph Hellcat to catch up to tuned TH


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[Jimmy N.]

It's been too long since I drove the 'Cat now, and haven't driven the 'Hawk enough yet, to have a good feel for the difference.
Maybe just the knowledge of that the 'Hawk is even heavier than the portly 'Cat plays in? It's supposed to be slower, so therefore it is?

 

[KoKoTee]

I have been reading a lot if interesting points of views here. But it baffles me that a lot of people here complain about gas mileage. What do you expect. 707HP, in a 6.2L Supercharged SUV and 30MPG? I drive 50 miles everyday in Los Angeles Traffic and average 13.5 - 14.5 MPG. The last thing on my mind is how much gas it chugged. Lets be realistic, if gas is your concern, don't get a Hawk go buy a prius and a tree to hug. Sure challengers and chargers get better gas mileage, its a mathematical and physical concept described as the surface area with respect to the direction of travel and how that surface has to move the air out of the way. No comparison there... SUV vs car.

For those complaining about looks, go buy a Urus or a G63, or better yet, an X5M so you can be like everyone else, hoping to get noticed when no one really cares. If you decide to buy a Hawk, its purely for you to enjoy. Forget the others, what do they know anyways...

A few folks on this thread get it, those who know a Hawk, know a Hawk, as for the others... well... they get to look like clowns as their presumptions look back at them in disappointment as the Hawk launches across the intersection. All they can do is sit there like dummies cause they got smacked upside the head by an SUV. I've hurt more feelings in my Hawk that I have in my ACR, simply because very few see it coming. And that, is worth every penny.

 

[Purerock105]

^^^Well, tell us how you really feel. 😂😂😂

I get the same gas mileage what-what on the Durango SRT as well. It's a 5500lb pig with a 6.4l. You can't be buying disposable income vehicles and critiquing gas mileage. NOT these.

Once I went all in on performance vehicles. I stopped calculating mpg in a negative way. If I can hit 23-24 mpg on a segment of a road trip? Fantabulous. But I didn't buy the car for that. 😁

 

[SNeal5966]

I agree, but there also needs to be balance between that and making money, which really is the end goal here.

If there was no end in sight to the ICE age, we might see more of that. But we all know the end is in sight, so it’s 6.2’s for EVERYONE...!!!


Which has its pros and cons, as it’s been very well discussed here. I think both sides have merit to their POV.



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Everyone keeps saying that the ICE age is ending, blah blah blah....

Electric cars are still only at around 2% market share total and pretty stagnant. If you understand the law of diffusion of innovation, that means they are still only selling to innovators and haven't even begun to sell to early adopters yet. You have to get through all the early adopters to get to the tipping point and enter into the early majority, which is like 15% to 20% market share to be successful. I don't see that happening anytime soon with such bad economics. The answer is not to force it though, which I fear may happen.....left to its own devices this will fail, at least as a mass market car. The electric car will never be affordable, mass production does not bring down the cost of rare earth metals in short supply. It actually causes them to increase, and the battery is a very very very large percentage of the cost of manufacturing. Just imagine if they did get market share though....the price of electricity will also skyrocket since the grid is not capable.....and you think these guys will get away without paying road taxes much longer? LOL you're delusional if you think that....

The new models are selling to some degree, so I suspect that is just reselling to a lot of the same customers with earlier models. Their market share year over year is pretty flat though, but I do think that this could be a nice niche business though.

 

[Thawkmike]

Everyone keeps saying that the ICE age is ending, blah blah blah....

Electric cars are still only at around 2% market share total and pretty stagnant. If you understand the law of diffusion of innovation, that means they are still only selling to innovators and haven't even begun to sell to early adopters yet. You have to get through all the early adopters to get to the tipping point and enter into the early majority, which is like 15% to 20% market share to be successful. I don't see that happening anytime soon with such bad economics. The answer is not to force it though, which I fear may happen.....left to its own devices this will fail, at least as a mass market car. The electric car will never be affordable, mass production does not bring down the cost of rare earth metals in short supply. It actually causes them to increase, and the battery is a very very very large percentage of the cost of manufacturing. Just imagine if they did get market share though....the price of electricity will also skyrocket since the grid is not capable.....and you think these guys will get away without paying road taxes much longer? LOL you're delusional if you think that....

The new models are selling to some degree, so I suspect that is just reselling to a lot of the same customers with earlier models. Their market share year over year is pretty flat though, but I do think that this could be a nice niche business though.

Ok, I agree, I should have said the end of the 6.2 being produced in the number we see today is in sight.

Probably not the end of ICE.


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[Jack_Toepfer]

I didn't do exhaustive research on the subject, but this is what I found as it relates to drag coefficients across the 3 HCs...
Jeep Grand Cherokee - 0.37
Dodge Charger - 0.35
Dodge Challenger - 0.39

My Dodge Charger HC, at over 5300lbs (4 occupants + luggage), maintained 28mpg over a 4 hour long trek from Buffalo NY to Sandusky OH. Avg speed was ~70mph. Bone stock. 2.62:1 rear gear.
A Trackhawk driving down the road is ~5500lbs.

There is absolutely no way that the negligible increase in c/d makes the MPG suffer so dramatically. The Trackhawk has a 3.70:1 gear ratio, and is AWD. If anything is making the MPG suffer it is the drivetrain losses. When they are on a dyno, the WHP between the cars and the Jeep are ~70-80whp ... that is significant! This isn't a wind tunnel, this is just the effort to put power down to the road.

An AWD Charger HC would suffer the same way a Trackhawk does, because those physics don't lie.

 

[Jimmy N.]

There is absolutely no way that the negligible increase in c/d makes the MPG suffer so dramatically. The Trackhawk has a 3.70:1 gear ratio, and is AWD.

I find those DC numbers a bit odd. Yes, the Challenger is a brick, but the 'Hawk is a larger box.

But be that as it may, those 3.70 gears (while helped slightly by taller tires) seem to play a big part.
Enough so that the 'Hawk's Lie-O-Meter only reads up to 20 mpg, rather than the 30 I'm used to in Rams and Challengers.

AWD? Audi proved, much to my surprise, that a driven wheel uses up more power than a driving one.